Taking a promotion is always a no-brainer…right?
This week, we hear from letter-writers who are up for promotions at their workplaces—but are having some mixed feelings about accepting them. One is less than thrilled at the increased scope of operation tasks, but is scared to reject a sure thing and look for other opportunities. Another has been promoted four times in the last eight years and wants a chance to settle in and grow their team. Join Jen and Sara as they help these letter-writers make sense of where and how they want to grow right now—with or without a title change.
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Jen Dionisio 0:00 When you commit to a job, it is not a marriage. You're not in it for better or worse or for a lifetime of ups and downs and changes. You're in it for as long as it meets your needs, and when it stops doing so, find a new job.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 0:32 Well, once again, I'm glad we don't do a video podcast.
Jen Dionisio 0:36 Feeling a little sweaty today?
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 0:38 Oh, it is so hot in my office. But nevertheless, I'm super excited to be here today. Let's get this thing done.
Jen Dionisio 0:45 Let's do it.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 0:46 Hey everyone. Welcome to "Per My Last Email:" the show about what to do when work gets weird. I'm Sara Wachter-Boettcher.
Jen Dionisio 0:52 And I'm Jen Dionisio. So Sara, what is our weird topic of the week?
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 0:58 Yeah, well, today we're talking about maybe something not super weird. We're talking about making career moves. Who hasn't wanted to do that? But specifically we are going to talk about what to do when an opportunity in front of you maybe looks good on paper, but may not actually be the thing you want to do.
Jen Dionisio 1:15 Yeah, this topic actually sounds right up my alley. Did you know that I declined a big promotion to come work with you at Active Voice.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 1:22 You know, I did know that, and honestly, I don't think I mentioned this at the time, but I was a little worried about that. I was a little worried that I couldn't offer you what that promotion could have offered you, I mean, at least not financially.
Jen Dionisio 1:35 Well, as I think you figured out, the other things that you had to offer, like time with you and the work we do, definitely trumped any sort of financial offering that could have come my way. Honestly, it's a good thing that that wasn't top of mind for me, because now, knowing what I know a year and a half later, that job would have been like presiding over the end of my team because layoffs hit so hard. All of our raises and bonuses got frozen, so I wouldn't have made that money anyway. And I mean, ultimately, Sara, the risky choice, actually ended up being more stable.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 2:15 Well, so far so good, right?
Jen Dionisio 2:17 Right.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 2:17 The tech downturn has been a little hard for us too in that it's a little harder to make sure people have money to be able to afford to work with us, but we are absolutely still here. And you know, Jen, I think our first dilemma writer has a lot in common with your situation. Are you ready to hear them?
Jen Dionisio 2:34 Ooh, yes, I am.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 2:35 Here is what he shared with us:
SP 2:38 I am currently an accounting manager at a company. Our small team handles all accounting and finance functions. My boss, the CFO, wants me to move into the Controller role in a few months, which sounds great, but I fear will have the same pros and cons of my current role with a new title. The pros: Competitive pay and bonus, Positive company environment, Good team dynamics, High level of respect and reliance at work, decent benefits (excluding PTO). The cons: Poor PTO policy, Unlikely to reach equity tier, Frequent data entry tasks to maintain operations, fix problems, cover for slacking team members, and meet my deadlines.
Recently, a headhunter contacted me about a Controller position at a rapidly growing financial company. The role offers slightly larger pay and bonuses, and I see a significant upside in this company's future growth compared to my current one. I have worked in this industry before. Given these circumstances, would you consider leaving a good role (with a promotion on the way) to pursue an opportunity with potentially higher upside?
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 3:40 So Jen, let's call this listener SP for "Safety or Potential." If you were SP right now, how would you figure out what to choose?
Jen Dionisio 3:49 Well, first I would ask SP to remember that their job right now is just to be on a fact finding mission. Right? They've spoken to a recruiter about the new position, but there's probably a pretty long interview process to come. So before they stress themselves out with the worry of like, "Do I stay or do I go?" take a beat and just focus on getting a really clear picture of what you want overall, SP. I kind of think about that as staying position agnostic. So then you can use your interview process to get a really clear picture about where this new job aligns with the vision you have for what you want next and where maybe it doesn't.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 4:31 Okay "position agnostic." Tell me more about what makes you say that.
Jen Dionisio 4:34 You know, I think so often when we've kind of lost steam in a job that we have or we don't really see much potential for it getting any different or better, we tend to kind of pin our hopes on like the next opportunity that shows up. But it may be that actually what SP really wants is neither of the options in front of them.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 4:54 Yeah.
Jen Dionisio 4:55 Right? And so thinking about "what I want next" more holistically I think can keep SP from setting himself up for, like, making that kind of false choice, like, "I stay, or I go. I do this, or I do that," and, like, gives him something really concrete to compare his options against.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 5:13 Yeah, like, so, for example, SP said that they don't want to do all that admin. I'm wondering when I read that, like, well, what does SP really want to be spending their time on? Like, what's the vision?
Jen Dionisio 5:22 Yeah, exactly. And so, SP, like, you may not know that vision yet, and that is totally okay. I actually do a lot of work with people to kind of figure out what that vision looks like, and usually where I start is by having people look back at their whole career so that you can get a feel for like, what has or hasn't worked for you in the past. Usually, when I do this with clients, I have them map out every role they've had on kind of a Y-axis. Starting from a scale of absolute peak to absolute valley, map out every single job you've had across that scale, and that lets you start to see the patterns of what's worked well for you and like what hasn't. And that can be everything from how you're spending your time to who you're spending that time with.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 6:15 I have stolen that mapping exercise from you, and it has been really interesting and pretty incredible to see what it brings up for people. I have had career strategy sessions with people who've used it to look back at a lot of different kinds of work like professor, bartender, flight attendant, like all kinds of stuff. And even though they're now often working in fields like design, you know, a very different field, looking back at this like range of jobs that they've gone through kind of still reveals a lot about who they are, about their values, about what they really need from a place of employment, and also, like, what are the things that really drain them? It also helps to see how they've changed over time. But there are certain things that even looking all way, way, way back, wind up being really relevant right now. Okay, so that's the peaks and valleys of each job. So then what?
Jen Dionisio 7:03 Yeah. So I think that mapping also has another function in that it can kind of flag some gaps, like, what haven't you gotten to experience yet? Like, what else is there? Once you've kind of spent some time reflecting on that, I always suggest kind of taking those insights and making a list of your must-haves, your nice-to-haves, and then your deal-breakers across a whole bunch of categories, from like the kind of environment you want to work in and the culture that you want to be part of to which values need to be aligned with in this new role, or what are kind of the growth opportunities that you're seeking? And then once you have this kind of raw list, you can start prioritizing the categories based on what matters most to you right now.
So SP, it sounds like compensation and growth are what's most important to you at the moment. And so that might mean some categories may not need to get, like, A+ marks in your next job in order to be the right move or the right choice. And so once you have those requirements down, it helps you make your choices from a place of self-awareness and self-knowledge. So you're less likely to be in that situation I was describing earlier, where you're just kind of reacting to whatever's offered to you or persuaded by like, one or two shiny things that aren't ultimately going to be enough to keep you satisfied long-term. Maybe the new place has an amazing PTO policy, which it sounds like you've been really missing, SP. But if they don't meet some of these other priorities, it will then be easy to spot that and say, "Yeah, this one's not for me."
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 8:45 Okay, so let's say SP does this work and they get that sense of what they want next. How would you then suggest they like apply it to the decision at hand?
Jen Dionisio 8:56 I think it can be a really powerful tool during the interview process, because knowing what you must have, or, like, what you're just not going to tolerate, lets you interview from a real, like, position of strength. And it sounds to me like, SP, you know you're not going to be at your current company forever, but it also sounds like it's not such like a toxic slog that you need to get out of there as fast as possible. So in your interviews, you can be really direct and specific about what you're asking for and kind of what aspects of your experience or your skills that you really want to showcase about yourself during the interview process. And it gives you a little space to spend less time selling yourself to whatever the new org is, and more about kind of making sure that you're sold on what they're offering you.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 9:53 I really like what you're saying about a position of strength, because it's like, "I already have a pretty good thing going. It's got its issues But it also has possibilities. So I can explore this opportunity with some real openness, but no need to, like, contort myself for it. If they want me, they're gonna make it fit me."
Jen Dionisio 10:12 Yeah, exactly. And so SP, like, I hope this is actually quite freeing for you. You can show up to these interviews maybe a bit more boldly than you have in the past. You can also be more direct about what you're looking for and more inquisitive about maybe some of those pink flags or red flags that you might notice as you're talking to people in that company. And hell, you may even be able to use some of these interviews to your advantage at your current job. Can you use a so-so offer as leverage to address some of the things that are really bothering you at your job right now, like how you're being stuck doing all of that data work? I feel like deep down, at the heart of the question you're asking SP is, what kind of risk should I take, and what happens if I take this new job and then regret it? You know, it's always a possibility, like, we can't know how anything will play out until it plays out.
But again, I think knowing yourself and your needs really cuts down on the likelihood of you making an uninformed decision. And that doesn't mean that there's no risk. Even in the description of this new company that you shared, it said "fast-growing" which says to me that there's gonna be some risk, right? Like, if the org is changing, it may be changing in ways that are hard to really predict or explain until it actually plateaus and hits that growth it's going for. But when you commit to a job, it is not a marriage. Like, you're not in it for better or worse or for a lifetime of ups and downs and changes. You're in it for as long as it meets your needs, and when it stops doing so, you can do exactly what you've probably done time and time before, find a new job. This is sort of the inevitable situation we all find ourselves in because very rarely do our jobs or our companies meet our hopes and our needs forever.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 12:06 Well, let's say that SP does some of this homework. They realize this new position that's on the table is like not the right fit. They don't continue in that interview process, then what? What do they do with where they are?
Jen Dionisio 12:19 SP mentioned that this promotion is a bit of a continuation of the status quo, and so while I would imagine that that's really disappointing if you plan to stay there forever, SP, it may be beneficial to you if this situation has made you realize that you're ready to move on to somewhere else. It's kind of the inverse of your interview position. Like you can also be much more bold and direct in how you operate at your current job, because ultimately, you know deep down that you're one foot out the door.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 12:53 Well, you know, and that actually made me think of something else, which is like, even if SP isn't one foot out the door, like, even if they're like, "Maybe I'm gonna stay a while," what if this is also an opportunity still to renegotiate how you're going to do that job? Like, SP seems to be really confident that the promotion means that they're going to still have to do all of this stuff they don't want to do, like the data entry and also other things. But I think even if SP doesn't move forward with this other option, they still might have a little bit of leverage in this company, because, like, their boss wants them to take the promotion.
Jen Dionisio 13:26 Yeah.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 13:26 Like, SP is not begging for this promotion. Their boss is asking them to do it. Like they need them to do it at some level. And so, SP, I'd ask you to think about, well, what are the conditions in which you'd be willing to take that job? What boundaries are you setting if you accept their request for you to become controller? What are some of the things that you would say are off the table if you take that role, and maybe also, what are some of the things that you're doing to cover for people, to keep things running smoothly, et cetera that maybe you just have to decide to stop doing?
Jen Dionisio 13:58 Yeah, I think that is great advice, whether you had another job offer or not. SP, you don't have to be so accommodating to the status quo or the things that make your work hard, period, and you especially don't have to right now, because it sounds like you're not trying to climb the ladder there or kind of play the game to get ahead. That frees you up to really kind of reinvest some of this time that maybe you were previously just like spending by banging your head against the wall trying to make change or to prop up those underperforming colleagues, and take that time and apply it to your job search instead, because it sounds to me like maybe this recruiter call has opened up a bit of a Pandora's box for you. And I know once you start to imagine like life somewhere else, it can be really hard to let that go and stay put.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 14:52 Well, and you know whether you are really gonna leave or not. I think it's such an important lesson. It's so easy to feel like you have to cover for everyone else, you have to overwork, you have to do all the stuff that's being thrown at you. But like, I think it's always wise to ask yourself, like, "What if I didn't? Whatever role I'm in, what if I really took the time to focus on what's mine and let the organization figure out how to cover its gaps, not just have me do it?" You know?
Jen Dionisio 15:20 Agreed. And I think Sara, again, I want to reiterate that point you made where it's like they want you, they need you it sounds like, and so asking for them to meet you halfway is something you should not feel at all bad about. Thank you so much for reaching out to us SP. We would really love to know how the interview process goes and what you decide to do, whether it's staying, going, or something totally different.
Emily Duncan 15:49 Hi, folks, it's Emily, PMLE's producer. So often when we read your dilemmas, we wish we could go even deeper with you in real time, not only to unpack your situation, but to help you navigate it over time. If you could use that kind of help, good news: Sara and Jen offer one-on-one coaching, and they have some open slots for new clients in these last months of 2024. Want to learn more about one-on-one coaching? Go to https://www.activevoicehq.com/coaching. Again, that's https://www.activevoicehq.com/coaching.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 16:21 And we're back. Jen, I have another question for you. Are you ready for it?
Jen Dionisio 16:31 Yeah, let's hear it.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 16:32 Okay. Our next dilemma comes from somebody who is also weighing if their next promotion is actually something that they want.
TF 16:42 I'm being targeted for a promotion from manager to product director, and even though I feel like I'm operating at that level and my work and feedback indicate that, I'm not sure I want the promotion. There's a lot of bureaucracy, politics and scope increase that comes with it and less time for my team, which is what I enjoy in my role.
I've been promoted 4 times in the past 8 years and I feel like I'm moving too fast. Once I get to a point where I get my level and scope, it increases again. I want some time to build and grow my team without worrying about promotion processes, sponsorships and scope increase every year.How can I progress and get rewarded without a promotion? And am I being silly for saying no to a promotion?
Jen Dionisio 17:21 Oh, Sara, I am so happy that we got asked this question, because I wish more people spent their time considering this: "Am I just taking a promotion because it's been offered to me, or do I actually want it?"
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 17:36 Oof Jen, that question is so loud. Why are you yelling at me? It's definitely something I have struggled with, and not just about promotions, but just sort of like when something is an opportunity to advance in any way, I feel really compelled to want to say yes. And I think there's part of me that, like, still remembers what it was like to grow up in a house where I was really often being compared to my older brother, and like, no matter what I did, I was judged as coming up short in some way. What that instilled in me was a lot of kind of, like, screwy competitiveness, where I was, like, "I have to take the hardest class. I gotta read the hardest book." I gotta do one better than whatever it is my brother had accomplished at whatever age he had been, you know, at the same time. And like, that is not a great way to live as a kid. It's also not an awesome way to approach your career when you're an adult.
And so what I found was that, like, any time I had a chance to go up in some way, I wanted to jump at it. There are some pros to that. You know, I got some good opportunities. But I also kind of realized eventually that this default response made it really easy for me to say yes to things that I didn't actually care about, or, maybe worse, that like were not aligned with my values. It made me want to say yes to stuff that didn't actually feel right just because it gave me that sense of progress or that sense of like recognition, like it scratched that itch that had long been there. And so what I ended up doing to kind of resolve that for myself, I didn't realize it at the time, but like, going to work for myself kind of took me out of the running for a lot of those things, and made it so that, like all of my career choices became nontraditional career choices, and I couldn't use anybody else's kind of measuring stick for them because it didn't map to what I was doing.
But I also think that's not like the only way to escape that particular kind of beast. So Jen, let's talk about this letter. I want to call this person TF, for "Too Fast," and I want to actually start with their second question: is TF being silly for not taking the promotion?
Jen Dionisio 19:40 It's funny. I'm glad you shared that story about you growing up, because I was actually the opposite. Like, I had really high-achieving people in my family, and so I just decided, like, "Can't beat them. I'm gonna put absolutely no pressure on myself," and almost have the opposite kind of challenge where I just, like, didn't really believe I could do as much as anyone else, and I would talk myself out of opportunities by thinking like, "Well, somebody else is better at this than I am." And so, testament that neither extreme is very healthy for people.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 20:18 Well, you know what they both are is reactive, right? They're reacting to a situation, as opposed to actually being more proactive or intentional, like coming from a place of, "What do I want? What do I care about?" Like, they're both reacting to ways you might have been treated, which is understandable and worth giving yourself grace for, by the way, TF, if you have any of those feelings, and also just might not be the way you want to keep living.
Jen Dionisio 20:43 Yeah, agreed on that note, TF, you are not silly at all for saying no to a promotion, as long as it's for the right reasons.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 20:54 Okay, so say more. What are right reasons?
Jen Dionisio 20:57 And I'm putting those "right reasons" in air quotes, I promise, but I kind of would explain it as almost the difference between making an informed choice and like we were just saying, like having a fear reaction. The right reasons to reject a promotion are the ones that tie back to your wants and your needs, like, whether those are your needs inside of work or your needs outside of work. TF, you said something like, you know, "I want to spend my time working with my team," building up, I'm assuming, like safety and culture within that group, and you won't have time to do it in this new role. That sounds to me like a choice that's very much based on how you want to spend your time, plus, I imagine, like, what you care about and what kind of work aligns with your values.
Or, let's say you're thinking like, "I don't want to get embroiled in all the politicking that happens at this level because," and I'm making this up, like, "right now, I'm caretaking and I don't have the extra emotional capacity to give to work." Again, like, that's a choice based on a real need or desire you have to protect your energy or to keep space for other things that you want to focus on. Basically, TF, I would suggest getting really clear on what things you may have to say no to in order to say yes to this promotion and then ask yourself if the trade-offs are worth it.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 22:20 Yeah. Well, speaking of that, then can we also talk about, like, what are some of the wrong reasons?
Jen Dionisio 22:25 Yeah, and again, "wrong" is in air quotes. You can't see me, but I'm making them furiously. But basically, those wrong reasons are ones that are rooted in fear, you know, of not knowing what to expect, or of worrying that you're not up to the challenge. I know that one quite well. Or of wondering if you have the right skills and abilities. And those could become valid reasons to say no, I'm not giving them like a blanket, like bad rating, but I do think it's really important to linger on those for a while, because we can really talk ourselves out of opportunities by focusing on falsehoods about ourselves or the situation. Like, Sara, financial concerns would have never impacted whether I joined Active Voice or not, but fear of being able to be a good teammate and colleague like that was scary as hell.
And to be honest, TF, I'm not hearing much of those wrong reasons in what you shared with us. You know it sounds to me like you're confident in your abilities, but you'd like an opportunity to like, enjoy where you are, instead of always having to jump to the next thing the minute you get comfortable. And it sounds like the benefits of the promotion don't really outweigh the downsides. And that's a perfectly reasonable reason to say no. You're not turning down promotions forever. You're just saying not right now. And if your gut is saying this isn't right, please, please listen to it, because I think we're all really quick to ignore our intuition or have faith that our instincts are right and true, and if you really start second-guessing yourself, I suggest doing the same exercise I recommended for SP earlier.
Document a very job agnostic set of career requirements and kind of measure your current role and this promotion against those. You know, you can play devil's advocate with yourself by really exploring the best and worst case scenarios of each of those choices. And I suspect you may get some pressure outside of yourself about turning down the role, and so being really clear on your "why" is going to keep you from being bullied or persuaded into making a choice that you don't wanna make. And that doesn't mean completely shutting down some of the rebuttals you may hear from like your managers or your peers about why you should reconsider. After all, like clearly they think that you would be great in this role, and clearly they need you to take on this role.
But that's just information to add to your pile of considerations. Like that is not a rule you must follow. And I think most of the time, a lot of that outside pressure is so much more about the other person than it actually is about you. They may have a need that they really want you to meet for them in this new role, or even if the pressure is coming from outside of work, like your friends or family, it could be about those people's own fears for themselves or on your behalf. I got a lot from my parents about leaving my "safe corporate job," and I'm using air quotes again because of how many people have gotten laid off from that safe corporate job, but they were like, "You got to make sure you could pay your mortgage."
And it was like, "Yes, I have thought about these things, thank you for worrying, but I have got my basic needs met." And I think that goes to show like, only you know what's right for you, and ultimately you're the one that has to live with the consequences of the choice that you make.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 26:03 You know, Jen, that does make me think about kind of another related reason I see people really like try to move up in their jobs, and it's cuz they've kind of internalized this belief that, like, they're only successful if their career decisions are legible to other people. That like, if their peers looked at their career choices, and we're like, "I don't get it," that then that means that they're not doing a good job. They're not successful, right? And that can be really hard. But I do think that that kind of external pressure, or sort of like internalized worries about other people's perceptions of you, I think that those are the loudest when we haven't spent time kind of developing that internal compass that you're talking about, Jen.
Like, the more clarity you have on what matters to you and what you care most about, and what you're optimizing for right now, the easier it is to kind of set aside some of those other people's opinions and not be so worried about perception, about like, what will look good on LinkedIn, or what you're going to be praised for. And you know, I think that's really important, because I've seen a lot of people make career decisions that looked good on paper, but even though their resume was getting more impressive, they were actually getting more and more miserable. Okay, so let's say that TF does some of this work we're talking about, and then they decide they indeed want to stick where they are. What about the rest of their question? How can TF progress and get rewarded without a promotion?
Jen Dionisio 27:34 Ooh, I love this question a lot, too, and I have a feeling you do as well, Sara, because it comes up so often in the people that we talk to, and it's subject matter we cover in a lot of our programs and workshops. So for TF, I think where I'd start is asking you, like, what kind of progress would you like to see in your life? I talk a lot about kind of this, like tree metaphor for growth, where you can either, like, root down and deepen your existing specialties, or you might branch out and kind of look at new and adjacent skills and opportunities, or really reach up, you know, again, climbing that ladder, increasing your responsibility and your scope.
And it sounds like that third option is not what interests you right now, but I am curious about how deepening or branching out feel to you. It sounds like building and growing your team is the thing that you're most excited about. So what does success look like there, and where might you need to invest in your own skills or your own practices in order to really make that vision real for yourself and for them? That will inform what, you know, we call your intrinsic goals, basically where the ambitions you have are not coming from, sort of external rewards or expectations, you know, that sort of LinkedIn crowd you're trying to impress, or the boss that you want to think you're special, but where the ambitions are actually coming instead from your internal needs and desires and values.
And we always say it's really healthy to have a good mix of extrinsic and intrinsic goals, but starting with the intrinsic ones is always a better place to start, because they are the goals that you can control. And so for you, those may be things like getting your team members more comfortable presenting their work or creating a healthier approach to giving and getting feedback from each other. Could be any number of things, and they may not be things that your leadership notices or cares about. And if that's the case, I'll say that in order to get the kinds of rewards or recognition that you might be seeking, you may have to be really proactive about championing yourself and the work that you're doing, sending out an email when you see that your team's hit a milestone that you're proud of. Or, you know, be really explicit about letting people know how you made it happen, so that they can do the same on their teams.
And you're not going to be able to guarantee that anyone will celebrate or care about these things, especially if their values and priorities are different from yours, but you could still celebrate the hell out of yourself and your team members without anyone needing to give you permission to do that.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 30:25 Yeah, and you know that also reminds me, it's often hard to give yourself permission to celebrate goals when those goals aren't legible to other people, like they aren't things other people would notice as goals, and so knowing what they are and knowing what success looks like, what are the new behaviors that you would be seeing on your team if you've done a really good job with building trust and safety? That's really important, because it's easy to kind of set an amorphous goal that's like, "I want to become a better manager." And that's wonderful, but like, okay, what specifically? Like, what are the specific areas you're trying to improve at, and then what would tell you that it's working? Because it's not necessarily something that's gonna be like, on a dashboard somewhere, on an OKR, somewhere.
So figuring out it's like, "Oh, I'm noticing people are speaking up more in meetings when they used to not speak up in meetings. I'm noticing people are sharing things with me they didn't used to share." That might be, you know, the kind of stuff that you need to look for, because then when you hit those goals, you can mark them. And I think that's really helpful to build some kind of ritual around marking those wins that are otherwise easy to ignore, especially because, TF, unfortunately, you're not going to get like that dopamine hit of LinkedIn kudos that you would get if you were changing your title to director. So what can you give yourself to make those other accomplishments feel good, to actually like, experience the positive feelings around them?
And so one example that has been really cool to see happen actually comes from somebody that I love from our community, Jess Star. She developed this really lovely ritual she does for herself, where, when she hits an important accomplishment or milestone for her, and it could be something like speaking up or right, like giving herself permission to sign up for an extracurricular thing she really wanted to do, but like, kept feeling she didn't have time for whatever it is, right, these nontraditional things, she writes down the accomplishment on these little tiles that reflect light and cast these rainbows all over the place, and then she hangs them in her window.
Jen Dionisio 32:34 Oh, they're so cool.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 32:35 And so now what she has is this just gorgeous array of dangling rainbows in her office that she can look at and that can remind her, "I've done a lot, and a lot of what I've done has been things that really matter to me, and it makes it feel real and important." So TF, if you stay put in your role, like, what's your rainbow? What's the ritual that you want to use that would help you mark those moments where you notice that you've really grown in your capacity as a people leader, that you've done something really hard? Mark those.
Jen Dionisio 33:09 Sara, I can imagine some people maybe hearing you say that and think like, "Well, but I still do want you know my bosses, to recognize all the hard work I'm doing," and TF, I'll say from experience, when I've shifted my focus to my intrinsic goals, I've often had like, the same amount of success I've had when I really went hard on my extrinsic ones, too. People notice and there are ripple effects that do resonate with people, even if it's not necessarily the thing that you're calling out or, you know, celebrating for yourself. So just know like that doesn't mean that you don't care at all about what people outside of your own brain think about you. It just means that you're not so dependent on that for feeling like the work you're doing is worthwhile.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 34:00 Yeah, I think we all deserve to be acknowledged and noticed for what we put in and celebrated for what we put in, and also, if that's our only source of validation, that can put us in a really rocky place. And so looking at, how do you balance that out with what you're doing for you can make all the difference.
Jen Dionisio 34:19 So TF, I think to kind of sum up the answer to both questions that you had, only you can say what's best for you, and so I really hope that you listen to yourself and make the choice about whether you take the promotion or not based on what you really need right now, knowing again, it's not forever. Sara, I think you could probably validate that you also don't think that TF is being silly. And in fact, I would say like doing something unexpected, like turning down an opportunity or a promotion, is actually really brave and kind of badass.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 34:57 Yeah, you know, a lot of people that I've met would like their lives a lot more if they allowed themselves to say no to something that's an opportunity but they don't actually want. And so TF, maybe you're one of them right now, and that's okay.
Sara Wachter-Boettcher 35:21 And that's it for this week's episode. Per My Last Email is a production of Active Voice. Check us out at https://www.activevoicehq.com/ and get all the past episodes, show notes, and full transcripts at https://pmleshow.com/. This episode was produced by Emily Duncan. Our theme music is "(I'm A) Modern Woman" by Maria T. Buy her album at https://thisismariat.bandcamp.com/. Thank you to Safety or Potential and Too Fast for submitting their stories to today's show. And thank you so much for listening. If you have a work dilemma that's eating away at you, please send it to us. If you go to https://pmleshow.com/ you can see a button to submit your story. See you next time.